[aclug-L] Re: Richard Reid

[Scott Rarden <srarden@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Ah, now this has become a discussion that, while I don't agree with=20
everything, I can immensely enjoy and learn from.  Some points that bug m=
e:

Has anyone noticed the French acting unilaterally in one of their former=20
African colonies?  They sent in troops and paramilitary to take over an=20
airport to protect their people.  Where was the international discussion =
over=20
that?  Okay, small potatoes compared to an actual invasion of Iraq.  But=20
watch France and Germany -- when they think something is in their nationa=
l=20
interest they will go after it as fast as the US does.  Some things are t=
rue=20
the world over...and unfortunately national interest often does boil down=
 to=20
what is in the interest of the people at the top.=20

Also, about materialism and commercialism, and us spreading it all over t=
he=20
world.  Anyone else notice that France and Germany have, at the very leas=
t,=20
played the knife edge of following the sanctions in Iraq?  Do not for a=20
moment thing that their official positions is all about pacifism or givin=
g=20
inspections a chance.  Some?  Maybe.  Most?  Possibly.  All?  I don't thi=
nk=20
so.

And speaking as a conservative -- I think we should pull all of our troop=
s out=20
of Europe aside from some liason troops necessary for NATO.  Or, let's pu=
t=20
them in some of the Central European countries. Are they trying to curry =
our=20
favor by backing our play in Iraq?  Undoubtedly that is some of it, thoug=
h I=20
like to think they are freshly out of communism enough to be a little=20
idealistic about experience.   But France and Germany would really like t=
o=20
see an EU, dominated by them, that is a major competitor to the US.  So=20
taking us down a peg or two would not hurt that process at all.

Hey, do I believe the US has done things in the past that I wouldn't supp=
ort. =20
Yes.  Do I believe if I knew everything it is doing now, I would support =
it? =20
Hardly.  Do I believe that it will stop doing those things? Hope springs=20
eternal.  But one of the things that bothers me about the internal=20
discussions about what we are doing and what we should be doing is that i=
t=20
usually gives the benefit of the doubt to other countries before ours. =20

Remember -- it wasn't that long ago compared to the Crusades that there w=
as a=20
Muslim empire (Constantinople...er...Istanbul didn't fall to just nobody =
and=20
when you hear Bin Laden mention Spain, there is a guy who needs to get ov=
er=20
it).  It wasn't that long ago that the French were running almost all of=20
Europe (Those Brits and Russians sure do throw a kink in people's plans).=
 =20
And it definitely wasn't that long ago that either Germany or Russia had =
its=20
eye on the world.  Have they forsaken all possibility of doing so again? =
=20
They might like to think so, but I doubt it.   Remember that Germany was=20
something other than Nazi between the Kaiser and Hitler.

And the thought that people should be holding other people responsible fo=
r=20
things that happened over 300 years ago (my ideal timeline would be much=20
shorter) is a bit absurd in my opinion.

And, since no one is thinking that we may be replacing the Iraqi version =
of=20
Abraham Lincoln (kudos to Jonah Goldberg on that one) and the status quo =
in=20
the Middle East in my opinion isn't too nice to the rest of the world, or=
 its=20
own people...well, if we are making a mistake on reasons for taking out=20
Saddam Hussein, it isn't something I am going to lose sleep over.  Japan =
and=20
Germany (for all their talk now) have been remarkably nicer to us after=20
WWII...so it isn't a certainty that by going in we would ruin things and=20
create more problems in the area.

And thanks for the great discussion!

Scott Rarden
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