[Freeciv-Dev] Re: Civ II player puzzled by ICS strategy (long)

["Mike Jing" <miky40@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Aliaga <aliaga@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

[snip]
> It seems we all agree on that. But I try to be careful when calling
> something a loophole. Let's face it: clever players will always find
> a new way to up their performance. Not all of these will be "illegal" nor 
> should be banned. In a game based in a few rules, however complex their 
> interactions, the brain of the Homo Sapiens is bound to find some trick or 
> other... and remember the whole species is suspected to have a penchant for 
> war AND tricks... something in our DNA-based rules.txt, maybe...     :-)
I didn't use the word "loophole" simply because I like the sound of it.  I 
think I did found a loophole in the game which makes a game-unbalancing 
strategy like ICS possible even at the highest difficulty setting.  Clearly, 
the concept of unhappiness and the existence of number-of-cities thresholds 
are designed as game-balancing features to limit the extent of outward 
expansion, i.e. once you have reached a certain number of cities, it makes 
more sense to expand upward (grow your cities bigger) rather than outward 
(found more cities) because you will run into hapiness problems if you have 
too many cities.  However, it can be circumvented in CivII by using a 
certain wonder or form of government.  That's what I call a loophole, and it 
can be easilly fixed in Freeciv (because the source is free, of course).
> My wish would be that for every possible "loophole" or "surefire" trick 
> there would be a way to nudge things so that successful strategies can be 
> waged against unavoidable defeat, thus allowing
> variety and fun to exist.
ICS in itself is not really a "loophole", or even a "surefire" trick.  It 
simple enjoys too much of an advantage due to the basic design of the game, 
and if there is no measure to limit its effectiveness, it will simply make 
any alternative strategy obsolete, while at the same time render a great 
part of game feeatures utterly irrelevant.  Fortunately, a counter-balancing 
measure is already built into the game.  The question is simply whether 
people are willing to use it or not.
> I know of at least one other good strategy game where that's the law
> of life, and there exist at least twenty "unstoppable" ways to win...
> True, it has needed a great deal of playtesting and bug-squashing and
> cheat-stomping over the years, but it's my only other candidate to 
> excellency against Civilization.
Here is hoping enough people will embrace this idea to make a different kind 
of Freeciv game possible.
Mike


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