[Freeciv-Dev] Re: (PR#7287) Extended Topologies

["Marcelo Burda" <NOSPAM_mburda@xxxxxxxxx>]

<URL: http://rt.freeciv.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=7287 >

Le ven 20/02/2004 à 00:35, Jason Short a écrit :
> <URL: http://rt.freeciv.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=7287 >
> 
> Marcelo Burda wrote:
> > <URL: http://rt.freeciv.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=7287 >
> > 
> > Le jeu 19/02/2004 à 22:48, Jason Short a écrit :
> > 
> >><URL: http://rt.freeciv.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=7287 >
> > 
> >
> You misunderstand what a mobius wrap is.
> 
> It's not
> 
> +c-defabc-d
> +| |||||| |
> +f-ABCDEF-a
> +l-GHIJKL-g
> +r-MNOPQR-m
> +g-STUVWX-s
> +| |||||| |
> +u-vwxstu-v
> 
> as you have it in your documentation.  This is an interesting wrapping 
> (probably better than a donut for a sphere approximation).  But an 
> offset wrapping may only be combined with simple wrapping or no wrapping 
> (I think), and no wrapping would be really bad.
i no call its sphere aproximation - there is not posible to make a
projection of a sphere there.
but sphere and torus are closed surfaces, there are not edges! 
> 
> A mobius wrap is where you reverse the direction of the map.
> 
>    x-ABCDEF-s
>    r-GHIJKL-m
>    l-MNOPQR-g
>    f-STUVWX-a
> 
Get paper (with squares) make a mobius strip, play with a pensil over it
alowing pas over edges! and you see my proposal of movius strip.

if you not alow pas over edges you get a classic topologie with a
extreme ratio.

your proposal are finded if you make a mobius strip with transparent
paper!!!! this is not the original concept of a movius strip.
but we can call it Jason Strip.
Jason Strip need reverse canvas and can only be implement in the
quincuntial patch.

But the tree proposal are related to Mobius Strip!, We can call it the
mobius strip like familly :=) (a happy one)

> so it may be combined with any other form of wrapping in the other 
> direction (I think).  Whether this would give you a fun map or not is 
> another question.
> 
> > REVERSE-SIMPLEST SIMPLEST-REVERSED and REVERSED-REVERSED WRAPS
> > combinings are QUINCUNTIAL TOPOS, we only need one of this not 3! 
> 
> So which one is it to be?  reversed-reversed gives a better projection 
> for the sphere, but simplest-reversed gives you just 2 singularities 
> (which can be hidden at the poles).
no there are 2 singularity in midle of reversed wriping edges AND in all
corners!!!

a reversed-reversed are a 45° rotation of the simplest-reversed,
this is more easy to undestand it in reversed-reversed!
but reversed-reversed are topological(math) the some as
simplest-reversed.

> 
> > NONE-SIMPLEST and SIMPLEST-NONE are the classical and the uranus( a
> > classica one too rotated 90°)
> 
> Yep.  I'm guessing nobody will ever want uranus, but I don't know.
> 
> > and more and more
> > 
> > it this best to limit the list to a selected set of topos.
> 
> Are you sure?  Who chooses what to limit it to?  And why shouldn't 
> people be able to use other topologies if the code can handle them, 
> simply because there's no topology ID for them?

i propose to make a id for all topological(math) different topologies:

0)Flat

1)classic( = ratated90(uranus))

2)quincuntial_SQ ( ratated45(simplest-reversed = rotated90
(reversed-simplest)

3)Torus

4)Mobius (rotated90(Mobius_V))

5)spin (rotated90(spin_V= none))


total of 6

etc if you like but, you need make normalize, and vector function for
its!!, not so easy than make the torus topologies.

eventulaly rotation of 90° can be Handled at client side in a futer
patch.
> 
> 
> > make a clima_function for generators to all 32 way to combine are a hard
> > work for only 6 reals topos!!
> 
> Maybe.  But I would hope that the different flags would combine 
> linearly, not exponentially, so we'd only really have about 5 cases.
> 
6
There are some more case of offset-offset, offset-reversed and
offset-none, but a this time i no want make the normalize code and
vector code for its ;-) personally i no see its very interesting, more i
see it bads(for the moments!)

this make a total of 9 of 32 combining

> >>Finally, examples.  The biggest problem we have is convincing people
> >>that we should provide these topologies.  The biggest selling point will
> >>probably be the quincunx topologies, which make a good approximation of
> >>a sphere.  But I can't figure out how to turn your earth scenario into a
> >>quincuncial earth,
> > 
> > the scenario need only good wraps to work fine as quincuntial. 
> > 
> >> since I don't know what the topology values are.
> > 
> > i not undestand you!
> > 
> > if you like play it for see you need instal Extended Topologie Patch And
> > Quincuntial patch in a litle old cvs version (patch no more compile in
> > the latest)
> > from a 21-jan-cvs
> > patch first ExtendedTopologies.V2.01.diff from (#7287)
> > then patch ExtendedTopologies.V3.01.diff from (#6721)
> > and you can play the scenario(#7295) with quincutial topo with -t
> > trident
> 
> I used the ExtendedTopologies but not quincuncial patch.
> 
> ---
> 
> Anyway, I suggest we start simple.  Take a simple feature or cleanup 
> from your patches (map_clima or city_map_iterate_known) and provide a 
> patch that just does that.
> 
> jason
-- 
 . /  .     '    ,    .      (*)   '        `     '      `    .    
  |    ,  |   `     ,     .      ,   '  Marcelo Julián Burda      .
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