[Freeciv-Dev] Re: Development Strategies [Was Documentation, Usability and Development]

[Raimar Falke <hawk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Mon, Dec 03, 2001 at 02:44:13PM -0500, Daniel L Speyer wrote:
> On Mon, 3 Dec 2001, Raimar Falke wrote:
> 
> > On Mon, Dec 03, 2001 at 01:58:52PM -0500, Daniel L Speyer wrote:
> > > On Mon, 3 Dec 2001, Raimar Falke wrote:
> > > > ... > [snip lengthy discussion]
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Yes we may run out, but this isn't and shouldn't be the problem.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Hinging a potential customizability on a limited resource is not good
> > > > > design.  We don't want to run up against this just as custom rulesets 
> > > > > get
> > > > > popular.  We've already run into this with nations (which we allow far
> > > > > more of, IIRC), and (I suspect) are losing potential developers beause
> > > > > their work can't be included.  
> > > > 
> > > > There is a patch and it _will_ be included before the next version. If
> > > > we run out of flags (currently 28) we will expand it to 64 or 128.
> > > 
> > > But do we want to go through this again?
> > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Also note:
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_CARAVAN=0,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_MISSILE,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_IGZOC,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_NONMIL,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_IGTER,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_CARRIER,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_ONEATTACK,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_PIKEMEN,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_HORSE,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_IGWALL,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_FIELDUNIT,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_AEGIS,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_FIGHTER,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_MARINES,
> > > > 1.53         (dwp      06-May-00):   F_PARTIAL_INVIS,    /* Invisibile 
> > > > except when adjacent (Submarine) */
> > > > 1.42         (jjm      27-Dec-99):   F_SETTLERS,         /* Does not 
> > > > include ability to found cities */
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_DIPLOMAT,
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_TRIREME,          /* Trireme 
> > > > sinking effect */
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_NUCLEAR,          /* Nuclear 
> > > > attack effect */
> > > > 1.16         (freeciv  30-Jan-99):   F_SPY,              /* Enhanced 
> > > > spy abilities */
> > > > 1.18         (freeciv  12-Feb-99):   F_TRANSFORM,        /* Can 
> > > > transform terrain types (Engineers) */
> > > > 1.34         (sebauer  12-Sep-99):   F_PARATROOPERS,
> > > > 1.39         (sebauer  20-Sep-99):   F_AIRBASE,          /* Can build 
> > > > Airbases */
> > > > 1.42         (jjm      27-Dec-99):   F_CITIES,           /* Can build 
> > > > cities */
> > > > 1.44         (jjm      10-Mar-00):   F_IGTIRED,          /* Ignore 
> > > > tired negative bonus when attacking */
> > > > 1.53         (dwp      06-May-00):   F_MISSILE_CARRIER,  /* Like 
> > > > F_CARRIER, but missiles only (Submarine) */
> > > > 1.53         (dwp      06-May-00):   F_NO_LAND_ATTACK,   /* Cannot 
> > > > attack vs land squares (Submarine) */
> > > > 1.4          (rfalke   28-Aug-01):   F_ADD_TO_CITY,      /* unit can 
> > > > add to city population */
> > > > 1.5          (rfalke   08-Sep-01):   F_FANATIC,          /* Only 
> > > > Fundamentalist government can build
> > > > 
> > > > So it looks like there are 3 flags added per year. I wonder why this
> > > > should change suddenly.
> > > 
> > > So far, interesting (i.e. requiring flags or equivalent) units have only
> > > been added when enslavedciv adds them.  If we can open up interesting
> > > ruleset building to anyone whose interested, we should see a lot more.
> > 
> > But extending the scheme only on vague ideas/proposals/possibilities
> > won't happen. I will think about it again _if_ we get requests for 3
> > flags per month.
> 
> I suppose limitation isn't really the main issue, though I'd like to see
> this get really big.
> 
> What occurs to me is that we *haven't* seen flags for all sorts of
> interesting rulesets, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who's thought
> about them.  I gave up because it looked too dificult -- too much time
> spent learning freeciv internals for the ideas I could write.  I'm a
> developer who's already gotten a few patches accepted: think how much more
> intimidating this would be to someone who only halfway knows how to
> program.

> The current system of flags *hasn't* worked for getting all sorts of
> interesting rulesets, so let's try changing it.

So you say that the reason that freeciv doesn't have more rulesets is
the way flags are handled? I disagree. But we booth don't know and
will never know.

        Raimar

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