[Freeciv-Dev] 4X TBS as driver for RPG

["Brandon J. Van Every" <vanevery@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

From: Mark Metson [mailto:markm@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
>
> OK, here are some more of the kinds of things I hope can
> eventually be
> achieved by use of free open-source code. Again this comes from a RPG
> background. In various RPG experiences I have found that a larger
> socioeconomic system in which the players do their
> adventuring is severely
> lacking. Admittedly most of my players never got into being lords and
> rulers and running nations. But I still wanted to have loardships and
> fiefs and nations on the map. So eventually I would like to
> be able to use
> various larger scale strategic games to do the framework, and insert
> individual characters into that framework.

Do you want the game to drive events, or do you as Gamemaster want to
drive events?  That's a major difference of philosophy.

If you plan to Gamemaster everything, then you need a "God mode" that
allows you to be any / all of the players in succession.

If you want the game to drive events, then I think you, the Gamemaster,
would need to write a whole lot of "game script / trigger" stuff.  Much
like people do for FPS stuff, to advance plot points within a level.  I
don't think you can just have the game playing itself like a regular
game.  I don't think RPG players would find it interesting to be inside
of a 4X TBS game.

You'd also want HTML hooks into the game map.  A mode where you click a
hex, and Python fires you off at a webpage.  That in and of itself
sounds easy.  Once the game is Pythonized, just about anything in the
game could have a HTML trigger added to it, somehow.

> In FreeCiv the kind of thing I'd want to do would be to compute a
> character's chance of surviving, or, better, generate a detailed
> character-level scenario for the player of the character to
> play, based on
> which unit the character was part of (or encountered) and
> what happened to that unit.

That sounds like a special kind of unit, with a special unit script.
Not a big deal.  Of course, you realize you are doing this
implementation work, right?  :-)  But I'm saying, it would be easy to do
in Python.

> Eventually it would be nice to also allow the individual
> characters to somehow effect the larger scale, such as maybe
> count a party
> of players as being effectively a "diplomat" or "spy" unit so that if
> their character-level play succeeds then that diplomat or spy
> action on
> the Civ scale would succeed whereas if their individual
> character play
> field that failure could be plugged into the Civ game as a
> failure on the
> part of the corresponding diplomat or spy unit.

But diplomats and spies aren't important in Freeciv.  They accomplish
trivial tasks, nothing so dramatic as a RPG would portray.  Here, you're
talking about adding a lot of rules detail to some section of the game.
If you are asking for a 4X TBS to be driving your RPG, you will be
writing a *lot* of stuff.  One would call it a major game version.  Ok
in my world view, it's supposed to be a game engine, not a game.  But
realize, a lot of work for yourself you're talking about there.

From my standpoint, there would be a need to express major rulesets.  A
distinction between engines and rulesets.  I do not know how long it
would take to provide that level of modularity.  I don't know what kind
of shape the Freeciv code is in.

I think you would have a much easier time if you're willing to just use
your imagination.  Use ProtoCiv (working title) as a manual RPG game
tracker, ala God mode and HTML and all of that.  Not a RPG game
simulator.  But this really depends on whether you think RPG or 4X TBS
is more important.

Incidentally, have you played King Of Dragon Pass?  You should.
www.a-sharp.com  In comp.games.development.design we've had vicious
debates about whether it's a RPG or a 4X TBS.  I say it's RPG first and
foremost, because story elements are the basic mechanic.  It can't be
4X, only 3X, there's really no way to eXterminate.


Cheers,                         www.indiegamedesign.com
Brandon Van Every               Seattle, WA

20% of the world is real.
80% is gobbledygook we make up inside our own heads.