[Freeciv-Dev] Re: BUG/PATCH: Overproduction problems (PR#670)

[zamar-fc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Joona Kiiski)]

>
>Joona Kiiski <zamar@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: 
>
>> a) I'm building settler (38/40). Then I decide to build a temple instead. If
>> I
>> change it directly I lose 19 shields. But if change it to warrior (38/10),
>> press turn done and after that change production to temple (28/10), and after
>> that disband the warrior I lose only 5 shields! 
>> 
>> b) I'm building Stock exchange (140/160) and then I think hmm... in fact I'd
>> like to build armors instead. I change the production to barracks (no
>> penalty) 
>> and on next turn I change production to armors, no penalty is added (100/80).
>> If I think I don't need barracks, I can sell it!
>> 
>> c) One more way to "cheat": I start building wonder which somebody else is
>> soon going to finish. I continue building it until I find advanced flight. 
>> Production may be something like (1200/300). After I've find advanced flight
>> I build a cheap wonder (300). Then I start building bombers (900 shields
>> without any penalty!). I get them really fast!! (1/turn)
>
>Good examples.  I think this is clearly an unintended loophole.
>
>> If you agree with me that this kind of behaviour is totally against the
>> spirit
>> of Civ2, please put this patch in CVS. In Civ2 you lose all shields which are
>> over the limit, but I think that 50 per cent penalty is enough. That's the
>> same
>> penalty when you for example change production from temple to warrior.
>
>To back up, the difference from Civ2 is deliberate, to try to reduce
>the advantages of micromanagement.  That is, if excess production is
>lost, then it is advantagous to adjust workers etc when near 
>completion to reduce any excess, for example optimising to produce
>more trade instead.  Then optimising again after completion etc, etc.
>
>It think it used to be that the change-production-type penalty was 
>always applied (eg, even if you change and change back), but currently 
>there is no penalty if you completed production the previous turn.
>I would say this "loophole" is the main "cause" of the problems in 
>your examples.
>
>I _guess_ the motivation for this loophole is that unless you "change 
>your mind" while building something, it means there is never any loss, 
>and thus you never have to micro-manage workers to reduce loss.
>
>Please explain in words the effect of your patch.  That is, what
>would the documentation say?  Do you always lose half of any excess?
>In that case, micro-management is again encouraged, but with 
>reduced benefit than if everything is lost.
>
>On the other hand if the change-production-penalty is always applied,
>then it is advantagous to micromanage when nearing completion when 
>you intend to change production type.  Hmmm...
>
>Really the main problem in the examples is the occurence of a big 
>over-production by changing to something with small cost, whereas
>the micromanagement issue is about usually-small over-productions 
>which occur during the normal course of producing things.  So maybe
>there is some middle ground between rewarding micromanagement and
>loopholes in the examples, but its not clear to me right now...
>
>(Maybe another way to look at it is that _any_ production change,
>even within a category, should have a penalty, which would make some
>logical sense, but be too substantial a change to really do.)
>
>-- David
>
>
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>

Okay, maybe I should explain a bit what my patch does.
It has no effect when you are normally building things.
The penalty is counted before new shields are added to stock.

Let's take few examples:

a) You are building riflemen (38/40). Your shield plus score is 15.
That makes (53/40). Riflemen is built and your shield score is (13/40)
Everything is just like before.

b) But if you building armor (71/80). Change it to riflemen (71/40)
Overproduction is counted (=31). Shields are added (86/40). Riflemen
is built. Your shields are (46/40). But now, because of overproduction,
penalty is counted(31 makes 16). And your shield score is (31/40).

COULD YOU PLEASE READ MY PATCH! Put it in CVS unless you have better
solution to this problem (and you are willing to code it ;)).

Waiting your answer,
Zamar