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[Freeciv] Re: Dirigible

[Freeciv] Re: Dirigible

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To: freeciv@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [Freeciv] Re: Dirigible
From: Marco Tarini <tarini@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 17:20:49 +0200
Reply-to: Marco Tarini <tarini@xxxxxxxxxxx>

NICE sprite Arturo!

Bonuses at huts:
Sorry, I believed that explorers had bonuses 
(maybe they do in some Microprose version?). 
I agree, no special rules for the dirigibles alone
(side note: but, maybe, that bonus should be added 
to both? makes sense to me).

Explorer obsolated by...
Currently "partisans" (never noticed this before, thanks Christian),
But maybe, if we had "dirigibles", these would be a more fit as 
a replacement for explorers.
After all, partisians are military (unhappy upkeep, attack capabilities,
martial law...), even if of a special kind  (with abilities, like ignore 
ZoneOfControl and move over any terrain, which neatly capture 
guerrilla effect, as we know).

Explorers and dirigibles would share much more:
they both would be peaceful (no unhappy upkeep, no attack, no ZOC, no
martial law etc).
They would be used for the same purpose (exploring).
Of course, dirigibles would do it better:
- by flying, dirigible would extend the explorer "move over anything" 
ability to sea as well.
- giving them movement 4 would let them go one square further than 
the explorer's 1x3.
- by vision=2 it would get to see further.

Semantics (I mean: meaning)
Dirigibles would boardly represent a more modern, tech-supported
version of explorers, in between Julio Verne style and the missions to the 
K2 and the poles. Say, form late 700 to early 900 for a reference. 

Whereas explorers are anything in between the Spanish solitary map-maker
in the newly discovered south america, the ancient roman reconnaissance 
unit, the ancient world adventurous sailor a-la Ulysses, etc.

((Semantically, partisans do not seem to be advancement of
explorers at all. When I think about partisans I think about the russian
patriots, common people in arms that opposed the nazi invasion
from behind their advancing front, or, say, the Italian anti-fascists 
that would go fighting living out in the wilderness, sabotaging, ambushing 
etc. They ignore terrain because they know every stone, 
valley, shortcut, path, river-cross etc of their land, considering also 
that they  went to live outside the city. Whereas explorers ignore terrain 
because they are expert general mounain climber, river crosser, etc
ready for the unknown))

Attacks from Ground 
I agree, considering the "bomber over ground unit" trick it is really
mandatory that dirigibles can be attacked by normal ground units. 
Helicopter rules would apply nicely.  
Not sure about the need-refill side effect.  
That would be really bad for an exploring unit. 
I kind of hoped that the "flies but can be attacked by ground" flag
and the "suffers if outside city" flag where separated in the code. 
They should be, really (for flexibility, to make mod-pack creation 
easier, etc). Then again, I never looked into the code much closely...


----- Original Message -----
From: "Christian Knoke" <chrisk@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <freeciv@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 10:42 AM
Subject: [Freeciv] Re: Dirigible

> On Wed, Aug 18, 2004 at 06:52:45AM +0200, Marco Tarini wrote:
> > And the poor explorer is currently alone in is unit-thread. Make
> > appear earlier, and then let dirigibles obsolete them later.
> Explorer is also for ZOC-ignore. It's obsoleted by partisans, this is
> Maybe the dirigible comes earlier, but shouldn't obsolete explorer then.
> Christian
> --
> Christian Knoke            * * *  
> * * * * * * * * *  Ceterum censeo Microsoft esse dividendum.

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