[Freeciv-Dev] Re: (PR#13864) Data: Kurd nation

["Christian Knoke" <chrisk@xxxxxxxxx>]

<URL: http://bugs.freeciv.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=13864 >

On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 11:28:15PM -0800, Daniel Markstedt wrote:
> > [chrisk - Thu Nov 03 17:15:45 2005]:
> > On Thu, Nov 03, 2005 at 07:44:54AM -0800, Daniel Markstedt wrote:
> > > 
> > > Updated Kurd ruleset.
> > 
> > I have headache with the mention of Abdullah Öcalan as a leader. 
> AFAIK he is
> > the leader of the PKK.

> Ok, I agree Öcalan is a slightly too controversial character for 
> Freeciv. But hey, he would be in good company amongst all the mass-
> murderers we have in our leader lists ;-)

True :-) But generally we choose only persons with a substantial historic
role which at least *might* have selected them as leader. You can't say this
from this guy IMHO.

> > Another point is that there are no cities from turkey in, while in
> > southern turkey there live lots of Kurds.

> AFAIK the autonomic province of Kurdistan in Iraq is the only legally 
> Kurdish territory in existence.

We should be clear with the distinction whether a Freeciv nation is a real
one (an independent state) or not. Kurds are not. So there is no legal
Kurdish territory.

> I don't think we should avoid adding more 'pseudo nations' to Freeciv -
>  If you try to make a clear distinction between nationality and 
> ethnicity, you will fail!

This may be very true.

Still, what you're doing here, is creating various Freeciv nations out of
ethnicities. You don't flag them as 'modern', so this is basically OK, and
adding new nations is not too bad.

What I wonder (and I cannot actually tell because I'm not so historic biased
as you) is on which base you make an ethnic a Freeciv nation. Ethnics change
in time. Which time you lay as a ground for cities (territory), leaders
a.s.o. Why this and not that? Some ethnics (like the Prussians in Germany)
are very well assimilated nowadays, so if you choose the actual time as a
base you will be just wrong. But which one do you choose? The identification
with a nation/ethnic change in time, too. Ideally this decision should be
made by people which have that identification. And if there are no such
people, there is no reason to create a Freeciv Nation for it.

> I'll put the Kurd nation on hold for now. Generally because the 
> situation in the region is as unstable as it is, making it difficult 
> to be impartial, and specifically because the flag is banned in 
> several countries (i.e. Iran and Syria). Let's avoid making Freeciv an 
> outlawed piece of software.

I consider this as 'political hot', and this should be reason enough to
*not* include it in Freeciv. Let's avoid making Freeciv a political piece of
software.

Christian

-- 
Christian Knoke            * * *            http://cknoke.de
* * * * * * * * *  Ceterum censeo Microsoft esse dividendum.