[Freeciv-Dev] Re: (PR#5777) Stuck building coinage in worklist

["ue80@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <ue80@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Mon, Sep 08, 2003 at 08:16:02AM -0700, John Wheeler wrote:
> 
> 
> --- Vasco Alexandre da Silva Costa
> <vasc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > 
> > On Mon, 8 Sep 2003, John Wheeler wrote:
> > 
> > >
> > > [vasc - Thu Sep  4 19:54:00 2003]:
> > >
> > > > On Wed, 3 Sep 2003, ue80@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Please refrain from automating things too much
> > people. We want
> > > > an interface which does not bother a user with
> > micromanagement,
> > > > but we also do not want to make something like
> > Master of Orion 3,
> > > > where the only thing you do is click turn done.
> > >
> > > Um, who is "we"?  I'll agree that I definitely
> > wouldn't want to play a
> > 
> > "We" is the maintainers.
> 
> Fair enough.  After all, if I really feel strongly
> enough about it, I can always go fork myself a new
> version of the code. ;-)

Like the war-client and other patches to increase the playability of the
game.

As player i don't like to repeat some actions .. why should i? I have a
computer, and a computer is good for automation.
 
> > I am not certain CMA was exactly a good idea (in the
> > way it was made
> > anyway). The UI is overly complex.

The CMA is not perfect, but is much better than nothing.
When i have first seen the CMA at FUADEC i had some ideas where it could
help more the player. But i think it's a very useful feature.
 
> To reiterate, I would hate to have to being twiddling
> sliders all the time, especially ones that affect the
> whole nation.  Except, I'm already doing that in
> Freeciv with the Tax Rates dialog.  Usually I just
> want to do stuff like "Maximize science, with no
> cities in disorder, and a minimal but positive cash
> flow" or "Make as many cities as possible have a
> WLTPD, then maximize the amount of science and don't
> worry about the cash flow until reserves get low".

Good idea, but sometimes you can't use all cities to do that, so you
should be able to attach cities to some of the different strategies.

> > Believe me you have no idea about what is a game
> > with heavy
> > micromanagement. Millenium 2.2, *that* had heavy
> > micromanagement. After 45
> > minutes I started wanting to bang my head against
> > the wall. :-(
> 
> I've had games in Civ 2 where one turn took over an
> hour.  And in empire I would frequently use up all my
> BTUs just moving stuff around.

I had freeciv games where some players looked at every city every turn
to do micromanagement, to tweak out 3-4 shields or gold. I think the
game is about strategies and not micromanagement. 

There are enough decicions that a player has to do. And when i need the
time for the micromanagement my decicions on strategies are really bad.

Like in teamgames where i have to look at 3-4 players and the techtrade.
Then i start to make many errors. 
  
> > Spending time sterilizing the game instead of
> > improving the graphics or
> > gameplay does not strike me as very productive.
> 
> Heh, improving graphics does not strike me as very
> productive, and I consider increasing both complexity
> and automation to be improving gameplay.  /A Chaque
> Son Gout/.

A good game doesn't need graphics to make it fun. But it makes more fun
with good graphics.
 

Thomas
-- 
Thomas Strub  ***  eMail ue80@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
jb: people are stupid, they don't want to learn.