[Freeciv-Dev] Re: Why fascism is bad but not communism (was Re: New Nazi cityset attached...)

[Reinier Post <rp@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On Fri, Aug 04, 2000 at 09:13:12PM -0400, Reed Meyer wrote:

>      If even one person, just *ONE*, objects to something, you should
> respond in exactly the same way as if the majority of the people objected.
> If you refuse to listen to the minority's objections, based ONLY the fact 
> that he is a minority, then no matter how you might try to "suger-coat"
> it, the bottom line is that you're behaving like a Nazi would.  As well as
> being a hypocrite.

I see your point - and I have already responded to it - but you are
overstating it.  Behaving according to the wishes of the majority
is known as democracy.  Democracy would mean holding a poll.
I don't think we want to hold a poll on this.  But to call
this 'behaving like a Nazi' is a little overdone.

> Pure (or "ideal", to use your term) fascism has absolutely NOTHING to do
> with this "Higher Race"/"Lower Race" stuff.

In that case, you should be proposing Italian symbols and names.

> ---Reed Meyer

It should be clear to you by now that Nazi symbols or a Fascism
government don't stand a chance of being included for the purely
emotional reason that including references to Nazism steps on many
people's toes.  But it's not the only reason.  It has also been
said that the proposals are not generic enough, and you're not
addressing that.

A nation representing Nazi Germany (or fascist Italy) would really
represent just a particular episode in that nation.  In the default
nation set, generic, politically neutral representations are more
appropriate.

The same problem exists with the proposed Fascist government.
Everybody agrees to call Mussolini's reign 'fascist', that's
what they called themselves.  But that doesn't make it a well
defined notion.  The existing government types (Despotism,
Monarchy, Republic, Democracy, Communism, Fundamentalism)
don't make all too much sense to me either but Fascism is
even harder to justify.

The only reason I'm interested in this discussion at all is because
your work may add something to Freeciv as a game.  If it would improve
the game to have a new government form with the rules you propose I'm
all for its inclusion, but the name should be linked more clearly to its
Freeciv effects, and with 'fascism' of which there are so few examples,
this link would also be controversial.

-- 
Reinier